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| Freestyle (1664 Posts)
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Freestyle Info |
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On 9/29/2001
TN -
wrote in from
(165.247.nnn.nnn)
Something about this forum seems to think freestyle only took place in the 60's and 70's. Right before its death, freestyle was at its most incredible in the mid to late 80's. The tricks were inventive and the footwork got to a point where the board just seemed skittering on teflon. Compared to the 70's it was like what happened to gymnastics after Nadia Comenici took it to a new level. Everything before her looked like a joke. Kevin Harris though not as tehnically adept at tricks had the most flow I've ever seen in footwork. Mutt was to freestyle what Jordan was to B-ball. Handstands were out. Tricks were things that only could be done on a skateboard. Unfortunately, the burst of creativity and technique happened right before the mags and makers called it quits on freestyle and conceded everything to street. Sure some folks on this forum don't like tricks in which the wheels leave the ground unless its a gorilla grip, but c'mon is any less "natural" than gymnastics on a board. I rather see casper or one foot edge to edge or 360 slide than a handstand.
I would love to see freestyle reemerge, but not if it becomes a nostalgia fest in which people discount anything after 79'. At least with slalom I see the potential to take it to a new level much in the way it's happened with downhill. I think freestyle can come back but with a modern twist. Let's look forward to what can happen.
Anyone freestyling in NYC?
Regarding Hall of Fame mine would go beyond 79. It would have:
Russ Howell for never losing his cookies while spinning and perhaps the raddest commercial for GT skateboards.
Pineapple (for getting us out of the Logan era)
Paul Hoffman for taking nose spin tricks to a new level
Kevin Harris for the smoothest footwork of all time
Mutt for dominating in a Hutson like way
Z-team for bringing on the slides and making Daffys look downright stupid
PS. I got a G & S Stinger (freestyle deck) for sale. Looking for a Rocco or Mullen.
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On 9/29/2001
Cliff Coleman
wrote in from
(165.247.nnn.nnn)
Glen,
Yes John Freis and Torger were credited with nose wheelies, kickturns, 360s and other early tricks.
For Lifetime achievment I recomend Dave Rochlen. He was the manager of the Southern CA Hobie team and was known as Mr. Head-dip in surfing. This guy was a great guy and took the team to all of their demos. He also wrote an article in the first Quarterly Skateboarder, "Performance Plus". He was involved in the development of the sport in many ways.
Glen, I agree with you that the first time a person drinks, even if it runs in the family it is a choice. The problem is that those with bad genetics have a more severe problem once they start.
Bob, the guy I mentioned earlier, Rudy Esquer was one of those greats who from my point of view was better than any other Skateboard Freestyler I ever saw in the middle 1960s. He was the captain of the Pipeliners Skateboard team. he now live in Maui and works for the county. He also happens to be the best Saxaphone player in the Islands. The Pipeliners were a group of guys that didn't have the backing of teams like Hobie and Rudy was unable to make it down south to the Anaheim International Championships, May 22nd and 23rd. He should go in on the first ballot if you ask me.
Glen, thanks for the information on Tina Trefethen.
Cliff Coleman
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On 9/29/2001
Bob Staton
wrote in from
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Ok, this is great...we are now rediscovering some of these great skaters from the clay wheel generation.
We have no nominations from the steel wheel generation as of yet.
For the awards presentation, I will need a program that has a picture, stats and a brief discription of the inductee.
So lets do this...10 skaters from the 60's and 10 skaters from the 70's
The skaters from the 60's seem to be free of major vice
issues, probably because of their age.
But we have few skaters that are remembered by more that one or two of you....but, hey! if that is all we have to work with, it will have to do.
Bob Staton
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On 9/29/2001 Glen
wrote in from
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Tina was a more gymnastic freestyler. Cliff you got her right as the one who crashed hardcore at Signal Hill. She is now married to a tennis pro and helped do the composites and design on Craig Breedloves latest land speed record car.
AS for John Freis. Isn't he the one credited with the kickturn? or was it the nose wheelie? He should be in.
I can see wanting to recognize people as role models, but that Carrasco guy has to go. :).
As far as genetics. I have the genetic propensity to go splat if I jump out of a plane at 30,000ft. It's my choice to do so or not. Being born with MS, Polio, or being fat and bald, is totally different.
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On 9/29/2001
Bob Staton
wrote in from
(4.41.nnn.nnn)
Greetings,
Cliff, you seem to have some very good documentation
on freestylers long forgoten. This is very important, it would be great to have pictures of these people also.
What I believe we should do on the first years induction is go with the most famous of these individuals.Maybe that is not the best, maybe we should include out standing freestylers that we know from personal knowledge were as good as those who got the most publicity...or prehaps a combo.
What will be needed is documentation or a hell of a good story.
Some of the people you guy's have mentioned I do remember and are solid like Bob Mohr, where others seen to be one shot wonders.
I know of someone that few have heard of that was as good as anyone of his time. He won the
Pier Av. contest in '65 and did a number of other great thingsin his life...he was the drummer for Dick Dale
for a few years also.
I don't have that much of an issue with the drug and
drink part of a skaters backgroundalthought with some ,I do feel it is an issue, so we should look at each person on a case by case basis.We can't judge Woody
the 10 year old skate star by the actions of Woody the 40 year old. However, with some one like Per H. , the
best and the worst happened at the same time.
I want to honor the people that were great skaters and
great people at the same time. People like Russ Howell. Per Welinder, Steve Day, YoYo Schulz, Steve Cathy, Ellen O'neal, Richy Carrasco, people of that
fabric...solid role models, people that over came ther
addictions etc. and have spent time with the kids and organizations and put a piece of there life back where they got it.....at least for the first 20.
We have plenty of time to sort out the deserving and their place of honor as the years roll by.
How about those other catagories...life time achievement etc.....Where would you place Dale Smith,
Peggy Hoffman, Everett Rosecrans, Primo and Diane,
Skip???
Bob staton
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On 9/29/2001
Cliff Coleman
wrote in from
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Glen,
I forgot to ask you if you would vote for John Freis? He beat everyone for the overall title at the first International Championships and tied Dave Hilton for third in the Freestyle division, 1/2 point behind Bruce Logan who took second. For those of you that don't know, Torger won the contest in Freestyle.
Here are the places and their points.
Class AA, Tricks:
1. Torger Johnson, 28.5 pts.
2. Bruce Logan, 27 pts.
3. (tie) John Freis, 26.5 pts.
Dave Hilton, 26.5 pts.
5. (tie) Steve Hilton, 26 pts.
Sammy Jiminez, 26 pts.
Steve Quirt, 26 pts.
Larry Sebastian, 26 pts.
9. Brian Beeman, 25.5 pts.
Danny Escalante, 25.5 pts.
11. Don Barker, 25 pts.
12. (tie) Gary Hill, 24.5 pts.
Brian Logan, 24.5 pts.
Bob Mohr, 24.5 pts.
15. (tie) John Guild, 24 pts.
Mike Power, 24 pts.
Karl Weber, 24 pts.
18. (tie) Ron Hatch, 23 pts.
Kevin Jones, 23 pts.
20. (tie) Jeff Greenelsh, 22 pts.---The Magazine says tie but not with whom.
Class A, Tricks: Ten and under.
1. Brandon Woodward, 28 pts.
2. Dave Kenny, 24.5 pts.
3. J. Mesa, 24 pts.
4. (tie) M. Hazitt, 22.5 pts.
Mike Lacy, 22.5 pts.
Dick Mohr, 22.5 pts.
7. Pete Burg, 21 pts.
8. (tie) J. Guild, 18.5 pts.
Andy Herrick, 18.5 pts.
10. Rick Anderson, 16.5 pts.
Girls, Tricks:
1. Laurie Turner, 25.5 pts.
2. Colleen Boyd, 24 pts.
3. Wendy Bearer, 23 pts.
4. Laurie Allen, 21 pts.
5. Valerie Perez, 20 pts.
6. Suzie Rowland, 17.5 pts.
7. Donna Cash, 15.5 pts.
8. Colleen Jones, 14 pts.
9. Paula Johnson, 13 pts.
10. Sherry Grindle, 12 pts.
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On 9/29/2001
Cliff Coleman
wrote in from
(199.174.nnn.nnn)
Glen,
Was Tina Trefethen a Freestyler? I raced at Signal Hill when she won the womens skatecar division and I was told that she was a hang gliding champion and they convinced her she might be able to win two world championships if whe raced the skate car. She did win but crashed after hitting the raised bump in the road beyond the speed trap. She went to the hospital with a punctured lung and was on the critical list for weeks.
Regarding Alcholism, do you believe in genetic propensities? The mother of my children died of Alcholism at the age of 39. It only took three years from the time she first began drinking until her death. I believe it does run in many families.
Cliff
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On 9/29/2001 Glen
wrote in from
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Bob, you skated Burbank banks?
Miller school, makes Revere look small, is 6 blocks downhill from my house, and Muir Jr. High is 8 blocks the other direction. Miller was awesome in the 70's, the banks are gone now though. Muir needs a resurface.
Bruce Logan should be in the Hall of Fame, based on his '65 Anaheim performance alone.
Torger died in a car crash. He was awesome and should be in as well.
Bob Mohr did take his own life a while back, but was a truely great skater from way back.
Steve and Dave Hilton should be in.
Danny Bearer should be in.
George Trafton
Russ Howell
Ed Nadalin
Chris Chaput
Steve Cathey
Paul Hoffman
Skitch Hitchcock
Ty Page
Tina Trefethen
Desiree Von Essen
Pineapple
Tom Sims
Sorry to disagree Cliff, but alcholism and drug addiction are not disesses they are choices that people make. Having lost a step-brother due to drug abuse, and damaged my own heart with speed. It was all due to choices not something we caught.
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On 9/29/2001
Bob Staton
wrote in from
(4.41.nnn.nnn)
Cliff,
I did talk to Chris and Ed that day at Morro. But I was sure I saw you on a longboard skating around in the street, on the slolom course, before they made us all leave... who was that white haired dude then???
I used to skate longboard with Ed and Brad back in the 70's, we would go to banked school yards like Burbank.
Brad and I worked for Mitchells skate shop in Garden Grove and Brad dated my daughter for a while,
Bob
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On 9/29/2001
Bob Staton
wrote in from
(4.41.nnn.nnn)
Hi,
There will be a Hall of fame catagory for families also.
So the Bardens and the Carrascos have been nominated as well as the Logans...who else.
To my recollection the first skateboard contest
was put on by Larry Stevenson/Makaha at Pier
Ave. Jr. High School in 1964. A guy named "Squeek"
won it.....who was he and where is he now?
Bob Staton
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On 9/29/2001
Cliff Coleman
wrote in from
(165.247.nnn.nnn)
Bob,
That was Chris Chaput at Moro Bay on an Ed Economy long board Freestyling after the race and he is still awesome. I did things like handstands, headstands, headstand spinners, L-sit to handstand, all forms of wheelies and most notably a backflip dismount at a Freestyle contest south of Santa Cruz in the 70s.
Cliff
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On 9/29/2001
Bob Staton
wrote in from
(4.41.nnn.nnn)
Hi Cliff,
You may remember me from the Morro Bay Slalom Championships, I was the guy watching you doing some killer freestyle on your longboard after the contest
You are still great! Come enter one of our freestyle contests. In fact, I invite you to join WFSA and be a part of the Hall of Fame selection team.
I'm all for inducting Woody but I believe he was on the Hobie Team with you, so you will all get in eventually, as a package deal along with the Hiltons.
Last time I saw Woody was about 2am, crawlling up the ivy embankment under the San Ysidro overpass in Montecito back in '88, with his parrot on his shoulder.
I had to throw him out of my cab for being drunk and disorderly. He called me back the next week for a ride home and he did not remember a thing. I used to see him frequently at East Beach where I practiced for contests. He tried my board a few times but could not do anything, nor did he try to, but he did like to give me
advice occasionally. A strange thing that was, when he was at the top of his game in the mid 60's, I could not possibly do the things he did, now, some 22 years later, he could not possibly do the things I did.
He is still around Monticeto somewhere, Scott Starr knows where to find him, I will bring him to the HoF awards in the spring...unless he gets rowdey and I
have to throw his butt out on the freeway...again!
Bob Staton
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On 9/29/2001
Cliff Coleman
wrote in from
(165.247.nnn.nnn)
Bob,
There were two Hobie teams in 1965. The original team was from Southern CA. They lived in the Pacific Palisades and Santa Monica Areas. The other team was the Northern hobie team. The Southern members that I remember were, Danny Bearer, National Champion 1964. Wendy Bearer, Danny's sister, Colleen Boyd, George Trafton, John Freis, Steve and Dave Hilton, Danny Schaffer and Torger Johnson. By the way, Torger Died in a car crash on the island of Kaui, HI. He was truly a great guy.
The Northern Hobie team consisted of Danny Escalante, Brian Beeman, both tied for 9th at the first International Skateboard Championships in Freestyle. Steve Peterson, Karl Weber, Cliff Coleman, Andy Herrick, Laurie Turner and Laura Allen.
Remember when you induct people that Drug addiction is a disease. You will write an incomplete history if you leave out people because of this or because of personalities. When Bruce Logan was young he was great.
Don't forget Bob Mohr. I hear he took his life but I'm not sure. He was great in the 60s and 70s. Matt Barden was one of Russ howell's proteges and was very good in the 70s. Micky Maga of Jack's Skateboard team was famous for his high jumps in the middle 60s. The Jack's team graced the cover of The Quarterly Skaterboarder magazine in 1965. Valerie Perez was a good Freestyler in 1965 and took third at the First International Skateboard Championships. Pat McGee was also an early skateboard champion and graced the cover of Life magazine in May, 1965.
Early teams of the 60s were Makaha, Hobie, Jack's, Kips, C&D Imperials, C&D Surf Team, Tuks and the Pipeliners. In the 70s the Alot-a-Flex team had many great riders. A guy named Primo Desiderio (sp?) from Southern CA was very good in the 70s. Rocko won contests also in the 70s.
There are so many that it takes a while to think back.
Cliff Coleman
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On 9/29/2001
Cliff Coleman
wrote in from
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I nominate Woody Woodward. At ten years of age he won every event he entered at the first International Skateboard Championships. Also John Freis, The Hiltons, Steve and Dave. From the Northern CA Hobie team, Laurie Turner, the overall winner in the female division at the first International championships. Danny Escalante of the northern Hobie team and Rudy Esquer, northern CA Freestyle Champion in 1965. From the 1970s, Dan Ewell, Freestyler from the Santa Cruz/Fat City teams. I'll think of others later.
Cliff Coleman
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On 9/29/2001
Bob Staton
wrote in from
(4.41.nnn.nnn)
Greetings! EG and Glen
Zephyer Team,...I remember skating with some of them
at Kentor Canyon School. Peggy Oki lives down the street from me. Can one of you give me a complete list
of the members of this team?
Oher teams under consideration are The Origional Makaha Team, The original Hobie Team ( Clif, is that you?) and the Pepsi Team. I need a list of these team members also. Any other teams?
Probably the selection will go to the oldest team this year, all of these teams WILL get inducted eventually.
Now lets deal with the bad boy issue...I have no recollection of Danny Bearer, so fill me in. Torger
was skateboardings first big star and died of a drug od
I think, but was generally accepted as an ok guy. however there has been some negative feedback on
his induction, not enough for me to bar him, so let me know where you stand on this guy.
Bruce Logan, lots of flack thrown at this guy. I had dealings with the other family members and they screwed me over. So getting them into a Hall of Fame is going to be a hard sell.
I do believe that there should be some record of recognition for the likes of these guys and all the other
greats of freestyle. What would you call it? The Hall of Legends? That would work for me.
All major Hall Of Fame's have a character quality aspect to there requirements. We all know Pete Rose's story.
No different here.
There are currently about 16 names being circulated
the have 100% approval, let me see if I can remember them off the top of my head.
Russ Howell
Ed Nadalin
Stacy Peralta
Ellen O'Neal
Chris Chaput
Steve Day
Steve Cathy
Paul Hoffman
Skitch Hitchcock
Ty Page
Lonny Toft
Who else?
The cut off year for this year's (2002) induction
for individuals 1979.
However there are some special catagory awards to
be given for outstanding whatever as recently as the 90's. Mostly we are considering the first generation freestylers from the 60's and 70's....mostly those skaters known to us via the media. We probably all know someone that was out standing but never got their 15 min. of fame. I would love to see some nominations for a few skaters from the 50's/steel wheel
era.
Enough for now. Just for the record, I'm 58 and have been skateboarding (every year nonstop) since the fall
of 1958. I started freestyling on a custom made freestyle board in 1960.
Bob
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On 9/28/2001 Glen
wrote in from
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I'd nominate Torger Johnson, Bruce Logan, Danny Bearer, and a few others but I don't think any of them, or many others, would pass the "lived a life of crime or dishonor.." test.
They all deserve to be in a Freestyle Hall of Fame though.
One that would pass is Russ Howell and he deserves to be in there too.
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On 9/27/2001
Bob Staton
wrote in from
(4.41.nnn.nnn)
Greetings!
For those of you who may not know...Freestyle is alive and well. You can tune in to the new and rapidly growing freestyle scene at Lilli's INFFS site at this addy:
www.reversefreestyle.com/f
On January 23rd of this year, Dan Gesmer,Stefan "Lillis" Akesson, and I Founded the World Freestyle
Skateboard Association, WFSA, to revive freestyle
on a new, stronger, and more permemate footing.
Since that day we have grown slowly into a real voice
for freestylers and have had or sanctioned 5 freestyle
contests including a Pro contest known as the Barrio Games and backed by Mars/M&M that put up a $2000. purse. This years World Championships will be held in Philly the end of November. Russ will MC.
WFSA has almost 100 members, 40 of these members
are what we call Area Reps and are activily promoting
freestyle in 8 different countries, including Antigua-Baruda, with demos and contests. The more members we have, the more we are able to show the
media and industry that we are serious about bringing freestyle back to the maintream and that there are the numbers to justify some attention and support......
Please join WFSA on the site I mentioned...it's free.
WFSA is planning to have a Freestyle Hall Of Fame
Awards Party (by invitation only) at the Hermosa Beach Skate Park, which is on the old Pier Av. Jr. High School
property, where Makaha staged the first ever skateboard contest,..... in the spring of 2002. Dale Smith will be the Host.
There will be 20 individuals inducted, and 10 to 12
other catagories for various other things like teams,
products, family groups, life time achievement etc.
the final selections have not been made yet , so feel free to nominate. The only restriction is that there
will be no geeks no matter how famous.....no one that has lived a live of crime, and dishonor will make it into the Hall of Fame on my watch.
I'm planning a 5 contest Freestyle and Slalom Am series for California for next year. Also, I will attempt to revive the Oceanside Contest as the State Championships next summer. Brandon Mason will
host the US Nationals in St Louis at the second
Gateway Classic, on labor day weekend, 2002.
There are several other small contests planned for this year in December in England and Germany.
All are welcome....Bob Staton
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On 9/27/2001 TN - my 2 cents
wrote in from
(165.247.nnn.nnn)
The first time I saw the kick flip featured was Ty Page in Skateboarder, ages ago. A few years ago Alan Gelfands "ollie". I used to freestyle from late 70's through the 80's all flatland footwork, spins, etc. Then when the mags and makers abondoned us for street, I really felt like a holdout. Kept freestyling until my Rocco got stolen and by then you couldn't find a freestyle deck for sale anywhere. So I'm hoping this post can help bring it back the way it's generated a new interest in slalom. Union Square in New York was my practice grounds. There was one incredible freestyler in the late 80's who used to own a skateshop named "eddie".
Anyway, I know there's alot of nostalgia for simpler times and technique but for freestyle to ever progress, you cannot make up rules just to DQ an "ollie". A flatland 360 ollie in a freestyle routine is poetry. An ollie impossible thrown in the middle of footwork is nothing short of jaw dropping. Unfortunately, just as freestyle was hitting a technical peak, the manufacturers / mags killed it. Ask Mutt. Powell planned and marketed the whole street thing at the expense of everything else. Now that we have the net and interst can generated without the mags, I hope freestyle comes back but not in the form of pathetic rock band reunion tour that caters to nostalgia and to the advancement of nothing.
In the meantime, I look forward to getting an old school.com deck and incorporate both new and old tricks.
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On 9/27/2001
Cliff Coleman
wrote in from
(165.247.nnn.nnn)
BoBo,
What are Moon Walks? I remember Space Walking.
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On 9/27/2001 todcar
wrote in from
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my two cents
Chaput on CBS sports spectacular is still my favorite freestyle moment. I like the flowing trick to trick stuff.
I always thought that form of freestyle where you stand on the trucks and use the entire board like a pogo stick was really stupid looking.
I'd like to see where the sport is these days - Ritchie C. does some amazing things.
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On 9/27/2001
BoBo
wrote in from
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Another freestyle trick not mentioned.
Moonwalks
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On 9/27/2001
Bob Loftin
wrote in from
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OK -- its fixed. Sorry for any confusion
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On 9/27/2001
Bob
wrote in from
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Regarding my Oldschool Skateboards FS board review --
The image on that page is incorrect -- its a diagram of a FS/street hybrid model I'm working on. I accidentally gave that image file the same name as the picture of the OSS FS board.
My commentary on the board is, however, still correct.
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On 9/26/2001
Lynn Cooper
wrote in from
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I've had an interesting day. A friend that I have never met, forwarded me to your site. Per Welinder, Lillis Akesson and I have started REVERSE FREESTYLE products. We're promoting Freestyle in a big way. :) You'll be hearing more real soon! An hour ago, Rodney Mullen called me to thank me for the Wheelin' in the Years video I gave him a few weeks ago, when he visited Denver. He was really stoked to see his contest routines. He told me that he didn't have any footage of the contests he entered in the 80's. I mentioned the Freestyle contests we've had this last year, SF, Chit Challenge... and he said he's really happy that we are all promoting Freestyle. Rodney said that he just finished a new Globe video that will be released in October. He said that whenever people watch him in a video, they really like the Freestyle sections the best. He usually puts more Street skating in his videos, but this time he decided to put 50% freestyle in the new video! I've been Freestyling since 1981. Rodney and I talked about the Magic Mountain contest that was held back then. It was cool talking with Rodney. He's not a God, he's just like us. There's something else REALLY cool coming out soon, but I'll have to save that for another time. If you ever come to Denver, the new Denver skatepark has a good area for Freestyle. I skate there quite a bit and the skaters really enjoy practicing Freestyle. Have a good one! www.skatelegends.com
Keep on Sk8in!.
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On 9/26/2001
Grumpy Ol Bastard
wrote in from
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A minor correction. I didn't review the old school FS board. Bob did. I'm too round to do all that spinning, I might generate my own gravitational field. He loved it though, he's had a few of them.
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